Stickers / Livery / Graphics

[Jason Naylor]

personally i don't think we should use '' local '' livery as we are all part of the '' national bigger picture '' therefore, considering all the recent press, we should keep this uniform as much as possible. Same as with the uniform argument, we all have bits and bobs we've done in local teams, but its not professional when looking from a national point of view.



you don't see fireman/paramedics/police using county level uniforms or logos, they go under a national brief, although split into county levels.



we should have one logo, one uniform and keep it real. then when called out, regardless of county, we'll still be recognised as part of the national unit.



theres no reason why the ****e can't hit an industrial sized fan with more than one county responding, under different colours wouldn't look very professional.

by all means have a local sticker 'AS WELL' but all standard logos should match countrywide IMO.

[Bob Hatcher]

Hi Jason,





The reason that teams have local logos is to identify the fact that they are local, people prefer to be members of something relatively local rather than national. Whether it be the local Mountain Rescue Team, Lifeboat crew Fire Service etc.



As far as I am aware every Police force has the word Police on their vehicles, but also identifies which force they belong to with the Force logo and also the LOCAL force website, often also with the local force "slogan".



This is the same for the NHS Ambulance service, Fire Brigade, Mountain Rescue and other organisations which are locally based but with a national identity.



That is the whole concept behind the National network, local groups speaking to local user bodies but SUPPORTED by the national network.



Just as there is no NATIONAL Police Force, or Ambulance services, but local services working to NATIONAL 'policies' interpreted for local conditions.



So it is with 4x4 Response we have local groups throughout the UK, under local control working to local users but providing mutual support to other groups AND other local charities as and when required with a commonality of purpose.



To take a local example from my area

All Police cars say POLICE we say 4x4 RESPONSE,

Avon & Somerset Police cars say on the sides Avon & Somerset Constabulary we say Wessex 4x4 Response.

Avon & Somerset cars have the web address www.avonandsomerset.police.uk we have the web address www.wessex4x4response.org.uk



Hence both Tony and I saying that we provide the recognised 4x4 response sticker, but local teams need to sort out their local stickers to identify the local team.



Avon & Somerset Police do not wear exactly the same uniform as Dorset or Gloucestershire etc, in fact not all members of the same force wear the same uniform but everyone recognises them as police because they are SIMILAR, even when one officer is in a white long sleeved shirt and the other is in a black poloshirt.



This might help to explain the view of the trustees.



There is certainly no intention for "4x4 Resonse" i.e. the national network to become the governing body, or impose specific standards but we do want member groups to work together .

As we say

What “4x4 response� is not, is a governing organisation and therefore we do not aim to tell groups that they have to adopt any logos, uniforms, or equipment, although they may well choose to adopt these based on National Guidelines something that we would encourage



As trustees we aim to encourage, not force groups to come to a concensus and adopt the best practises around the country.

[jamie read]

cheers Bob, sort of thinking of using the "national orange/white sandwich" but saying Tayside 4x4 Response on it.

this is all, of course, subject to the outcome of the meeting. it might turn out that everyone wants an individual logo, but i like the idea of using the origonal background, just altering the text as it will give the impression of a national outfit and instilling confidence in the "user".

[Mel Fox]

Well said Bob!



You Jason talk about not being professional. I personally don't think using the terminology like S**** on the national website looks too professional myself , then maybe I'm just old fashioned

[Tim Childe]

Well, without re-opening the can of worms - I agree both ways.



It needs to be Local - and clearly identified as such. Â*But it also needs to be recognised Nationally - which is why my preference is for a Local Logo based on the National Logo.









And yes, Police and Ambulances are different locally, but hen I'm in London I can still tell which cars are police cars from the livery....even though it's different.



I think some groups go to far - there's at least one group on here that I couldn't recognise as anything to do with 4x4 Response, and if I can't the public won't.









But in the end it's own to the local group to make their own decision on this and go with it - whether the other groups or individuals agree or not.









I can't scroll back far enough to see the post - but someone said that the 'only thing provided was the 4x4 Response sticker'. Â*In this instance what does "provided" mean, and how do I get mine

[Tony Ferrari]

Quite an interesting discussion and also interesting to see Jason's perception that Police, Fire and Ambulance don't have County uniforms.



Of course this is a commonly held perception and is the result of similarity rather than uniformity.



However Police Services in England and Wales have only recently adopted common uniforms in the last couple of years, Ambulance Trusts are obviously now at Regional level and although they have very similar uniforms (largely green) they do have variations. East of England are shortly to switch back to white shirts from the current green.



And Fire Services are to have a new national uniform in England and Wales but this has not yet been rolled out. And of course Scotland and Northern Ireland are different.



All three of course have different vehicle liveries but I bet most people you ask would say Police Cars and Ambulances are white and fire engines are red.



Yet we all know that Police cars these days can be silver, black, dark blue, red or even electric blue in the case of the Essex Imprezas



And Ambulances are mostly yellow these days



And there are a few Fire Services that use flourescent orange vehicles.



So why do we have these perceptions?



Well largely because we remember what has been in use for many years and that imprints on our subconcious, so looks like we have a long way to go



One thing we can do is if we are visiting shows this year to have a common brand when publicising ourselves. So the National schemes should predominate with local schemes taking a lesser role?



For instance which groups are these from?

[Mark Avo]

Why not just collate all the local ones & that way everyone can see whats about & the newbies can blag whatever they fancy??

[Bob Hatcher]

[quote name='TimChilde' date='31 January 2010 - 04:22 PM' timestamp='1264954926' post='11511']

I can't scroll back far enough to see the post - but someone said that the 'only thing provided was the 4x4 Response sticker'. Â*In this instance what does "provided" mean, and how do I get mine

[/quote]



Tim 'provided' means that we source them nationally to ensure that they are all the same and then supply to local teams at cost (the last lot were 50p each) the teams then issue them to their members. By doing this as we have done for a few years now we have a atandard 4x4RESPONSE sticker, which you might say is equivalent to POLICE, FIRE, AMBULANCE, MOUNTAIN RESCUE, COASTGUARD etc i.e a simple sign that will become imprinted in the public mind.

[jamie read]

so, Bob correct me if i`m wrong, but you can supply us with 4x4 RESPONSE stickers? If so, how much and how much notice do you need when ordering?

[Bob Hatcher]

Hi Jay,



As Tony mentioned, earlier in this thread we (nationally) are currently looking for a new supplier as soon as we have the right price Tony as Treasurer will order a large quantity at which time we will be able to advise cost and delivery time. The aim as always is to keep the price as low as possible. ideally at much the same level as last time.

Tim 'provided' means that we source them nationally to ensure that they are all the same and then supply to local teams at cost (the last lot were 50p each)